Episode 47

full
Published on:

20th Apr 2026

The KINKY BOOTS (2005) Review

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Hosts Beck and Dash open with weather and small talk before reviewing the film Kinky Boots, noting it’s based on a true story about a struggling rural shoe factory that pivots to making boots for drag performers. They discuss whether it qualifies as a queer film, arguing it’s as much about capitalism, craftsmanship vs late-stage capitalism, and masculinity as it is about lgbtq visibility. They analyze Lola/Simon’s portrayal, queer trauma without punishment, rural–urban contrast, Don’s homophobia and growth, and Charlie’s flaws and eventual public humiliation at the Milan shoe show before Lola’s troupe saves the presentation. They connect themes of identity, chosen family, and being “seen,” and close with an Appalachian “noun of interest” segment on clogging and shoes as cultural expression.

00:00 Podcast Welcome and Weather

00:35 Umbrella Fails on Campus

01:41 Basement Dungeon Tour

02:23 TV and Movie Tangent

04:09 Kinky Boots First Impressions

05:31 Is It a Queer Movie

08:39 True Story and Themes

10:24 Shoes as Metaphor and Money

18:41 Opening Scene and Queer Trauma

26:18 Charlie Meets Lola in London

31:19 Factory Reactions and Style

34:03 Milan Show and Identity Choices

37:00 Lola and Gender Labels

38:12 Don Polices Masculinity

41:05 Arm Wrestling Turning Point

43:36 Strength and Saving Face

47:34 Sponsor Sensitivity Training

50:34 Mortgage and Breakup Fallout

54:53 Milan Runway Humiliation

58:09 Drag Shows and Gay Bars

59:28 Appalachian Clogging Shoes

01:03:33 Queer Films and Hollywood

01:09:06 Wrapping Up and Farewell

Transcript
Speaker:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Welcome to Queer Next, the podcast that

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puts the Yee Hall in y'all means hall.

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I'm your host, Beck,

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

and I'm your host.

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Dash.

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Welcome to today's episode.

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the windchill is nine degrees here.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Oh, that's just stupid.

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I'm sorry.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: They don't have

like spring and fall don't happen here.

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It's just winter and summer,

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

It's, uh, 62 here.

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I'm looking, feels like 60, but it

has rained and rained and rained

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and rained and rained and rained.

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S smore.

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I've gotten dredged on campus

twice in the last week.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Again,

what happened to your new umbrella?

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: so

I bought an umbrella and I took it to

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campus and I had not used it before.

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And so I came out of Central Hall

and because there's a little overhang

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there, like there's part of the,

the porch there you could stand on.

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And I try.

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I tried for like five minutes to

get this stupid umbrella to work.

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Two of my students tried to make it work.

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None of us got it to work.

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It was, the way that it works is you're

supposed to push the button and it pops

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out and then it comes out in two steps.

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And the second step that kept

flipping the outer edge of it

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out and it would not stay open.

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Like there was nothing there.

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There was no mechanism

to keep the thing open.

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So I gave up on that on the first one

and the second time it happened was

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yesterday and it had rained all morning.

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And then when I got to

campus it was beautiful out.

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Beautiful.

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And I thought, you know, I'm only

gonna be in here for 45 minutes.

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'cause I knew it was a short day

and I was like, it'll be fine.

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So I left my umbrella in the car

and walked out and it was pour in

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the rain, so I deserved that one.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Yeah, it doesn't rain here.

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I don't know.

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It's weird.

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Like if it does too,

everybody's basement floods.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Well, that sucks.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

have a basement?

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: yeah, I do.

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It's more of a dungeon.

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It's damp and has very low ceilings,

and I don't know, somebody, like I said,

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like there was a kid living down there,

but I, before I bought this house,

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but I wouldn't wish that on anybody.

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That's where the laundry room is,

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: yeah.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

and it has these secret rooms.

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Like there's one room that it is

just dirt, it's like a cellar.

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It's just dirt walls and floor.

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And I'm like, what is, somebody decided

this needed to be here, but why?

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

they do canning?

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Maybe.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: there's no

shelves, but that's what I thought.

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I was like, this could have been,

or just really weird storage.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Maybe that's where they put the bodies.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Have you,

there's a new version of the burbs on tv.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I started watching it and then

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I forgot I was watching it.

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And I haven't seen more

than like four episodes.

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Yeah.

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I do that all the time,

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Well, how many episodes did you

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

like four.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

What were your thoughts?

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Was it

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I liked it.

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I thought I liked the, the actress that

was playing, uh, the, the main character.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Kiki

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

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I like her.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: she's so funny.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

She has a podcast.

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The, she was in a movie with SZA that

I, I really think, I don't know if it

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flew under the radar is the right word,

because maybe, maybe like majority

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culture didn't watch it, but you know,

black people loved it or whatever.

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'cause it was about, like, it was

more about like black experience

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in a certain kind of neighborhood.

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It was called one of them days.

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I loved it.

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It really reminded me of those nineties

movies like Friday, you know, kind

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of just a day in the life of what,

what happens to a person with like an

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identity or a set of responsibilities

associated to their context.

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but it was so funny 'cause it

was these two women and their

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chemistry was incredible.

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I thought like, oh, okay, ssa

like another like singer or

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rapper is gonna be an actor now.

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But she was great.

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She was so funny.

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Yeah.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

maybe we'll watch it.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Highly recommend it.

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Oh, that'd be great.

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'cause I, I actually only saw it the one

time and it was when I was super high.

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I watched a lot of stuff while

I was recover or like either

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in the, the worst part of the

pain or recovering from surgery.

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That was really, I think good,

but I barely remember it.

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I just sort of remember

the sensation of liking it.

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But I also probably

liked the pills I was on.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right,

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Like, was this the movie or

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

the ambiance,

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: the company?

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Kinky Boots.

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Welcome to a kinky episode of Queer.

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This is not that.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: you

know, the, the, the one thing I can

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say is it was absolutely not what I

expected whatsoever in a very good way.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

What were you, what what

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impression did it give you on the

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surface before you,

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

With, the name alone.

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I thought there was gonna be, and

I knew there was a musical with it.

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I thought there was

gonna be a lot more camp.

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I thought it was gonna be a lot

more drag queen centered, you know,

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I thought it was gonna be, uh,

a lot more high key than it was.

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But instead it was just

a, a real story, you know?

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And I, I, I, I read something

about it and it's based on a

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true story, which is really rad.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Isn't

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

yeah, I thought it, I thought

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it was, I thought it was great.

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I liked it a lot.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

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I knew I, you know, I remembered liking

it, but this, like watching it now, and it

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came out, uh, 20 years ago, and this was

during the, the time of like Hedwig and

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the Angry Inch and, some, this is the same

year, uh, broke Back Mountain came out.

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We were, we were sort of putting, dipping

a toe into mainstream queer movies again

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for the first time since before the,

uh, the height of the AIDS epidemic.

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This time when I watched it, I was

actually really emotionally affected

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by it in a, in a interesting way.

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Like I wasn't 20 years ago.

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I actually cried a couple times.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: wow.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Just,

well, because I think it's major

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themes are stuff I didn't pick up on.

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And there are things that are

really meaningful to me now.

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Like 20 years ago, wasn't keyed into

masculinity theory like the urban rural

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so the, the major themes in, in the

movie were kind of, they kind of flew

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over my head a little bit, so I was

thinking like, is this even a queer movie?

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Like it's, it's got drag drag in it,

but the only sexuality that's mentioned.

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heterosexuality.

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Did we even need, I don't even think we

needed that love story though, between

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I, yeah, I agree.

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I agree

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I

think that that was to app.

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I think that that was an olive

branch to straight people

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: You

know, the trope, the, the trope of having,

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um, a black friend that takes care of

the problem or whatever, that solves

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your problem, that's a trope many times.

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Um, I think that that was put in

place here, but with the added twist

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of the gay black best friend 'cause I

mean, they weren't best friends, but

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they, the relationship had a similar

kind of, you know, they were doing

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something for each other and there

was some rapport there, you know?

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I

know what you, I, 'cause I, I was

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thinking of like the magical negro,

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That's, yeah.

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Yeah.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: shows

up, which is VI mean, I think

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that's, it is an American trope.

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but I thought that same thing.

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I was like, huh.

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And it's not just him.

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It's also Lauren.

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There's the woman who saves him as well.

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So I think there's queerness in

it and there's a queerness to

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it, but I don't know if I would

characterize Kinky Boots as a queer

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Yeah, I get that

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: think it's

more salient themes are capitalist

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and it's masculinity, right?

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Like most of the, the learning for

instance, is about masculinity,

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the growth that happens in it.

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Like who changes the most?

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

one of the things I wrote down here

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was, um, didn't make it overly gay,

which made it more realistic, in

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my opinion, just the right amount.

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'Cause I think it, it is not that it

should, like we should be making media

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so that it's palatable, but I think

it is palatable to a wider audience.

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And I think that will open up, if not

minds, uh, at least pathways for thinking,

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you know, like the, the bigots in the

movie, you know, as they made them

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and saw the, the impact of them, they

really changed their minds about things.

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Um, and I think, think that if somebody

sees a, a film that has a gayness in

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it and they still like the movie, then

that opens a little door that maybe

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they can like things that are gay.

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Even if they aren't gay.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I

think that's in the movie too.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: a person has

to be able to see themselves in something

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before they'll really consider it.

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As like, we are just so selfish

hard for us to commit the massive

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amount of effort it takes to

change our minds about something

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unless we can see what's in it for

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: And the

character who changes the most, the

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character who represents like that is Don.

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I loved and I had kind

of forgotten about it.

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I, I loved his, the way that

Lola opened things up for him.

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So I guess to just do a quick

summary of like what it's about.

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'cause it, it is based on a true story,

which is interesting and, and I'm, it's

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like literally a true story I thought.

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Like, oh, okay, sure.

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There was some like.

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Uh, traditional men's shoe

factory in the north that started

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making shoes for drag queen.

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No, it really, really did.

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And there was a whole BBC special on it.

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And the people, someone saw that special

and decided to make the movie out of it.

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The characters are created, but

it was even filmed in the factory,

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in a factory in the north.

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And there, like a lot of the

extras in that scene, they

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were just employees of that

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Oh wow.

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I thought it was interesting how

the topic came up last week, how

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it was a real situation when I

talked about my dad having drag

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queens coming into the porno shop

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: my

parents owned because it was the one place

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to get size 13 go-go boots, you know?

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And I had never thought about other

people having the same kind of

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experience or wear those size 13 Go-Go

boots came from in the first place.

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So it was really interesting to see that.

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I think

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: The idea of

changing your whole business model because

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you saw an opportunity like that there.

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There's a, an a sub theme of the movie is

kind of is bravery and knowing yourself

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and being willing to take a chance on

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

for sure.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: And

so yeah, it's capitalist because

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it's supply and demand, right?

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Like our company is struggling,

who needs something?

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Like what, what is a, a niche

audience that hasn't been catered to?

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Let's cater to them.

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That's the essence of capitalism.

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But there's another critique in the movie

of late stage capitalism specifically,

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with the, the shitty shoes maybe we'll

talk about it when we get there, but,

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of my favorite kinds of metaphor.

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There.

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There is a bunch of different kinds of

metaphor, and I don't know, we're getting

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really into the weeds here, listeners.

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I don't know how much y'all care about

this, but, my two favorites kinds of

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metaphor are, uh, synecdoche and metonymy.

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So metonymy is when a, a body

part or a person's physical

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self stands for something else.

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an example I use is, can I

have your hand in marriage?

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Like, you're not marrying their hand.

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You're hopefully marrying all of them.

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So that's autonomy.

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Syn is when.

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A physical item, an inanimate

object stands for something

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larger, maybe even a person.

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So the crown, when referring to

the monarchy, so the shoes or shoes

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function as a syne in this, and we're

told that, I don't know if the movie

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fully believes what it says where his,

his father says it, you can tell a, a

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lot about a person from their shoes.

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We find out later that his father

didn't really believe in a lot of

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things that we thought he believed in

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Right, right.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: one big thing.

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So I don't know if he

really believed that.

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I don't know if Charlie believes it,

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

uh, I don't know.

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I thought there was a line.

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He said, be brave.

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Decide one way or another.

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Do me a favor and show up tomorrow.

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Looking like your passport.

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Right.

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And he, he's talking to um, Simon,

we'll call him 'cause that's who

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he is, trying to speak to the,

the, the, the male person there.

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And I think, I think he was in it for the

money, which, I mean, any reason that you

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go into diversity is a good one, I guess.

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But he was definitely in it just for the

money and for the, for the job saving.

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I think that he was still, as the

culture makes one, sometimes a bigot.

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You know, I don't think that he

was able to see the humanity.

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I think he started to see the humanity

in the main character, whose name

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I can't think of at the moment.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Lola.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Lola.

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He sees the humanity in Lola at the

end, I think when the, when she shows

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up for the fashion show in Milan.

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I think that's when he

finally gets it, you know?

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah, there

were a lot of moments where I didn't like

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

I think that that's okay.

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I think that we're supposed to see a lot

of flaws in him, that was the biggest one.

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And he told us later, he tells us

why he'd said those things to her.

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And because, uh, Lauren was

confronting him and he said, just

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felt like a failure of a man.

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And so he attacked Lola.

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He attacked Simon.

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He attacked both.

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: and that's

another thing, like the movie isn't

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really, it's not using what we, our

current understandings of gender and

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performance and identity and things.

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It's, it's working with a, an

older set of, I don't even know if

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definitions is a good way to put it.

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An older, looser framework for talking

about performance versus identity.

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were very kind of intertwined.

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But yeah, he just chose that moment to

punish her for the most of the movie.

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They do use, she, her, when referring

to Lola, but at the, at the beginning

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though, like Charlie and his

father, they're not the same people.

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Like Charlie doesn't share

his dad's passion for shoes.

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And we, like, we see him

throughout the movie.

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He, he wears these truly horrible shoes.

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Like they're just like scuffed

up Walmart looking white shoes,

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really, really ugly shoes.

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So if we, if we were to believe

that you can learn a lot about

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a person from their shoes,

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beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Charlie's word out.

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dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: He's worn

out and he doesn't have an identity yet.

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Like he doesn't know who he is yet.

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They're not branded.

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They don't have any style

or fashion of any kind.

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They're not even particularly good

at being what they are for, right?

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'cause they're like, they look like

a pair of knockoff basketball shoes.

326

:

He's not a basketball

327

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

328

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: and you

probably couldn't play basketball in them.

329

:

Like they're truly just not there.

330

:

We see the movie through

shoes a lot of times.

331

:

One question I had was, so like he,

his father dies, Charlie's father dies

332

:

and he has to take over the factory.

333

:

And then very soon after that

he learns that the factory

334

:

is struggling financially.

335

:

he goes to London to try to sell the

factory to somebody or to sell the shoes.

336

:

He had a big backlog of shoes

and the guy was like, I don't

337

:

wanna buy your nice shoes.

338

:

want to buy these shitty shoes so

that people have to come back and

339

:

buy more of them very quickly.

340

:

That is an ex, that's an explicit

reference to Terry Pratchett's theory.

341

:

He had this, this theory, Sam Vimes'.

342

:

Boots theory of Socioeconomic

Unfairness, I think.

343

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Is it the one where you buy

344

:

the $10 ones every year and the

$51 ones last for a long time?

345

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: yep.

346

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

347

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

348

:

And he, and he, what?

349

:

He's in the context of the, this

was in the Disc World series.

350

:

I forget which book it was.

351

:

Basically it was, he was illustrating

that it, it's expensive to be

352

:

poor, that it is more expensive to

be poor than it is to to be rich.

353

:

Because a poor person can afford a $10

pair of shoes that wears out every year.

354

:

Whereas a rich person can afford

a $50 pair of shoes that lasts for

355

:

many years, and over time poverty tax

basically adds up to being more money.

356

:

So that, like, it, that scene right

there, like it seemed so explicit to me

357

:

that that's what they were referencing.

358

:

And so we did bring money into this

pretty, like, at the beginning because

359

:

it's a factory, it's a business, but it's,

I think, I think they wanted to put a

360

:

separation in there between craftsmanship

and mass production, specifically

361

:

in a, in a capitalist context.

362

:

Every, you know, they need to make

money, but they want to produce a

363

:

good product the same time, which is

not how late stage capitalism works.

364

:

, Like I'm thinking of quite a few products

like Carhartt, for instance, the, the

365

:

farm, the, uh, brands that make like

clothing for people who work in trades.

366

:

They used to be pretty crazy

expensive, but you had to buy,

367

:

you only bought the thing once.

368

:

You know,

369

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Sounds like my bra.

370

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: brass are a big

371

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

So I've been using, I've been

372

:

wearing the same kind of bra 'cause

I have a particular size chest.

373

:

Right.

374

:

So I buy my bras at Lane Bryant

'cause they're always nice and,

375

:

you know, well-made and whatever.

376

:

They're expensive.

377

:

And I've been wearing the same bra

from them, I would say 20 years.

378

:

I've been wearing the same bra from them.

379

:

And we ordered, they had

a sale the other day.

380

:

They were $20 a piece.

381

:

So I ordered two and, and Shena

ordered one and we got 'em here.

382

:

And they are half the

quality of what I'm used to.

383

:

They're thinner, they're lighter.

384

:

They're, they're, the, the,

the material isn't as good.

385

:

They're smaller.

386

:

Like overall, all of it.

387

:

I was not impressed whatsoever.

388

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

389

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Same way with her underwear.

390

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: say it.

391

:

I'm sure it is affected.

392

:

I mean, and it's, it's

not just clothing either.

393

:

Like cars are similar, like the,

it's better business to sell a shitty

394

:

product that is the hideous truth of

capitalism, late stage capitalism at,

395

:

in, its in, its like most insidious

form that we currently find ourselves.

396

:

And so they're out of step with, with.

397

:

That this price shoe company is, is not

in step with, this new economy, this,

398

:

this latest inter iteration of capitalism.

399

:

The fact that this is from 20 years

ago is that tracks, you know, like

400

:

that is about when I remember noticing

everything was getting so much shittier.

401

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: I feel

like a lot of food is doing that too.

402

:

Food isn't the same as it used to be.

403

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

what do they shrink?

404

:

Inflammation.

405

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Yeah, it's the, uh, when I wrote

406

:

about it in college, they called it

the, uh, disappearing cereal box.

407

:

You know, it says, or the, the

incredible she shrinking box.

408

:

It'll, you know, the,

409

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

410

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

you'll have a 12 ounce box, and

411

:

then the next time around, it's a

10 ounce box, and then it's an eight

412

:

ounce box, all for the same price.

413

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

414

:

And I think that that is a big, that

critique is stays in this movie like this.

415

:

I was surprised that there was as

much discussion about the industry

416

:

itself and it like economics

in the movie, again, there's as

417

:

much that as there is queerness.

418

:

So when the, when we, the movie

opens on Lola's face, little, little

419

:

Baby Simon, maybe 10 years old is

420

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

421

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: he

looks like he is, and he's sitting

422

:

on a pier or dock or something.

423

:

I don't know what he's outside of it.

424

:

First I thought it was

a beauty store, but.

425

:

sitting there and he's

bored and he's cold.

426

:

So it's like that, that universal kid

experience of being left in the car

427

:

while, while the grownups go do something.

428

:

And he pulls out a pair of like stiletto,

red stiletto heels from the bag next

429

:

to him and starts playing around.

430

:

Really adorable scene.

431

:

But immediately, my question is,

whose fucking shoes were those?

432

:

Why were they there?

433

:

Because he was there with his dad.

434

:

Whose shoes were they?

435

:

Were they his, because they fit him?

436

:

I don't understand.

437

:

Like, because in the, the next thing,

like his dad catches him and is mad

438

:

at him, but who bought in the shoes?

439

:

Are those his?

440

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Well,

it also could be a memory or a fantasy.

441

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Oh my

God, I didn't think about that.

442

:

Like in his mind, he's

just mashing up a bunch of

443

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

444

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: that

kind of capture the essence.

445

:

Yeah, totally.

446

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

what I think of some of the bad

447

:

things that happened when I was young.

448

:

Some of it gets conflated and, and mixed

around and, you know, that kind of thing.

449

:

You get older, it gets harder

to remember things and sometimes

450

:

things you wished happened get mixed

up with things that did happen.

451

:

And maybe he f wished he did have

the freedom to do that, but his

452

:

dad yelled at him too much anyway,

you know, even without the shoes.

453

:

Yeah.

454

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: It's like a

tableau of a lot of themes coming together

455

:

and I, I felt that way watching it too.

456

:

I was like, ugh.

457

:

I remember the moments of like, when I

was home alone, or not alone, but when,

458

:

you know, mom and dad were gone and I

could, you know, put, put my, uh, chest

459

:

binding on and just go out and live inside

my head be, be who I felt like I was.

460

:

Then that like, even if you don't get

caught, you know that it's gonna come to

461

:

an end because somebody's gonna come home.

462

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

463

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: know,

you like, you have to go back.

464

:

So like, there was, there was an

emotional undertow for me in this

465

:

very first, I was like, this was,

the credits are still rolling.

466

:

And the scene ends in a kind

of shame and, and panic because

467

:

he's caught and he feels bad.

468

:

That's all we get to know about

the specifics of Lola's childhood.

469

:

, And it's enough for us to glean

how she relates to it, how, like,

470

:

how those pieces still affect her

471

:

but we're not spending a

ton of time in that trauma.

472

:

Which I was grateful for.

473

:

This was during a time when you

didn't get to see a queer movie unless

474

:

somebody was being absolutely punished.

475

:

Not, especially, not a mainstream one.

476

:

So I was like, yeah, she's got

queer trauma slash baggage, but

477

:

it's not, it doesn't define her.

478

:

That's not the character

we're here to spend time with.

479

:

In some ways I kind of feel bad

for wanting that because I'm

480

:

like, yes, every, the things that

that affect a person negatively

481

:

are, are important and valid too.

482

:

But like, I don't wanna see that.

483

:

That's something the only thing I

want to see on screen all the time.

484

:

But we see, we, we sort of contrast that

with Charlie and his father and it's

485

:

very pastoral and, and bucolic where they

live, they're like the Midlands, which is.

486

:

I, I don't, it's like the, the Midwest

suburbs of England, like very beautiful

487

:

and green and stuff like that.

488

:

It's a kind of, it's a contrast

with Lola's urban surroundings.

489

:

So that's one of the, this sort of,

it's not an overt theme, but like this

490

:

idea of the country versus the city.

491

:

And Charlie's, introduction

to Charlie as a kid is very,

492

:

is very different than Lola's.

493

:

It's very, like, his father is so

benevolent and knowledgeable and kind,

494

:

and Charlie's experience, Charlie's

childhood is so idyllic and then he

495

:

grows up and he's still not happy.

496

:

Like, he, he also doesn't

fit in his surroundings.

497

:

Do you think the movie's trying to

equate those two things like Charlie's.

498

:

Charlie's experience of being a, not

fitting in with his home and Lola's

499

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: I mean,

I, I'm sure it should, would probably be

500

:

an idea in the director's mind at least.

501

:

Um.

502

:

Maybe if they want them to

see the same kind of humanity.

503

:

Right?

504

:

Because a lot of times when you're not

queer especially, and you see a queer

505

:

character, you have a special or a,

a kind of, uh, a schema, I guess, uh,

506

:

of the way that you think about them.

507

:

And it's not always positive.

508

:

So to see both of them struggling

in the same way as children,

509

:

I think that's pretty good.

510

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

511

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

'cause we don't, in straight films,

512

:

we don't acknowledge the pain of

queerness very often unless, like

513

:

you said, they're being obliterated.

514

:

Right.

515

:

There's not a lot of queer joy.

516

:

There's not a lot of queer love,

there's not a lot of queer, you

517

:

know, good emotions whatsoever.

518

:

So yeah, I think probably long way,

long-winded way of saying yes, I agree.

519

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Well,

and because there is at least one

520

:

big similarity, and it's that the,

the pressures that they're both

521

:

struggling under are patriarchal.

522

:

It's masculinity that is oppressing

both of these boys in different ways.

523

:

So for, for little baby Simon, it is in

his gender presentation specifically,

524

:

he wants to wear women's clothing.

525

:

we don't even know if

he identifies as gay.

526

:

We don't know anything

about Hi, how, how he dates.

527

:

We just know that identifies as

someone who is not masculine.

528

:

And then for Charlie, I don't know, he,

I mean, it's definitely a patriarchal

529

:

pressure, but it's different.

530

:

It feels more like a kind of

overbearing, this like his father's

531

:

personality and his identity as.

532

:

A cobbler with somebody who makes

shoes so oppressive that Charlie

533

:

is, he's, he doesn't even, he's not

given the freedom to find out or

534

:

to ask who he is, what his passions

535

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

536

:

One thing I really thought that,

um, after, after I was done with

537

:

the movie, I was sitting there

thinking about it, you know?

538

:

And beyond that, I really liked it.

539

:

I thought that it really, if somebody

watched this with, you know, any

540

:

kind of openness whatsoever, it would

make the homophobes kind of look

541

:

at themselves in the mirror like

it did don the character, you know?

542

:

And I think that's a really.

543

:

Good quality for a film, right?

544

:

If you can make homophobes be like,

wait, baby, that's not a good idea.

545

:

If that's anything that does,

that is is a great media, right?

546

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Are we the baddies?

547

:

Uh, yeah.

548

:

And, and this, it was a heavy

lift for a movie at this time too,

549

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: yeah.

550

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: wasn't many

movies that tried to speak to both

551

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

552

:

Oh, and you were saying that,

um, I what were you saying?

553

:

The, that we didn't see

much of Lola's life.

554

:

They do give you one little peek in

there when, when she's at her apartment

555

:

and the landlady says, are you a man?

556

:

And she's like, yes I am.

557

:

You know, she's like, that's fine.

558

:

I just wanna know how to leave the toilet.

559

:

You know?

560

:

That was such an epic, like showing that

shows you exactly how you should be.

561

:

It shouldn't matter.

562

:

Right.

563

:

So I loved that little bright

light in the middle of everything.

564

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Well, and

that's another theme of, of the whole

565

:

movie is the ways people can surprise you.

566

:

and, and the ways this is a, a trope

of British queer cinema actually.

567

:

There's couple of other movies that

are specifically about like how the

568

:

rural bumpkin northerners, Northern is

redneck in British or in Britain, right?

569

:

If they say Northerner, that's

what they mean is redneck.

570

:

And about how those folks can surprise

you if you just give them a chance.

571

:

So that's, that's interesting.

572

:

They have that trope, and I can't

think of very many tropes in where,

573

:

like, Hollywood's not making many

movies where the redneck surprises you.

574

:

But then, so Charlie meets Lola because

he went to London to ask the dude to

575

:

buy some of his overstock because the,

the, the big order had fallen through

576

:

and he sees, uh, her getting harassed.

577

:

A question I had, it's an uncomfortable

question because I feel like I

578

:

know what the answer is, is would

Charlie have helped her if he had

579

:

known that she was a drag queen?

580

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

That's a good question.

581

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: cause he white

582

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

yeah, based on the way that

583

:

he reacts to her later in the

film, I don't think he would've.

584

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I wonder.

585

:

You know, and I, I, it's so

interesting that the movie

586

:

allows us to ask that question.

587

:

It allows us to be suspicious of Charlie.

588

:

not trying to make him into

some infallible person.

589

:

' Cause I, because it, it was

a, I don't, I'm sure there's a

590

:

name for this trope, but like.

591

:

He saw her outta the corner of his eye.

592

:

She's being harassed by these dudes

and he just, you know, runs over

593

:

there and tries to protect her.

594

:

And it's funny because she accidentally

knocks him out and stuff, but I, I

595

:

wonder if he would've tried to help.

596

:

I don't know.

597

:

Maybe.

598

:

But it's one of those, like some,

I think sometimes we, all kind of

599

:

have to ask ourselves like, would

I have done that if I had known X?

600

:

But then she accidentally knocks

him out with her broken heel.

601

:

This is where the concept of the shoe, the

problem comes up her heels are not strong

602

:

enough to hold her up because she is,

Lola is played by Chiwetel Ejio Gio for,

603

:

who a martial artist and not a small man.

604

:

Very muscular.

605

:

His performance as Lola

is interesting too, like.

606

:

I, I'm contrasting it in my mind with like

the, all the straight guys in two Wong Fu.

607

:

Right.

608

:

The way that they like really camp

it up, like Patrick Stu, Patrick

609

:

Stewart, Patrick Swayze in particular.

610

:

Like his, his way of like, he literally

just glides through that movie.

611

:

And then John Zamo is swishing

Wesley Snipes is like a,

612

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Slinking.

613

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: doing full.

614

:

Yeah, like Banja girl, you know, like

drag queen from the hood type of thing.

615

:

Like he, he definitely, these folks

watched Paris is burning and the

616

:

behind the scenes too of that, like

they did work with real drag queens.

617

:

They learned a lot about queer

culture to do that movie.

618

:

So, but you know, this one is very

much not like, he's just kind of soft.

619

:

He's not mincing.

620

:

He is making jokes and he's quippy.

621

:

There are times when he made me cackle

622

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah,

623

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: wasn't doing

like, he wasn't doing jokes about Dixon

624

:

balls or assholes or, you know, it

was, he was doing observational comedy

625

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

please God tell me I've not

626

:

inspired something burgundy.

627

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: the

first time he went, this is

628

:

like chew, chill in the air.

629

:

I keeled over laughing 'cause it's

like, do you say in that moment

630

:

where, where you've misunderstood and

there's a hell of a fight going on and

631

:

you're like, I need to make my exit.

632

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

One of my favorites was

633

:

when he said about his dad.

634

:

He said he wouldn't even talk to

me even when he got to lung cancer.

635

:

So it's ironic, really

fags got him in the end.

636

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: the

facts got him in the, and in those

637

:

moments, Joel Edgerton's character,

Joel Edgerton as Charlie is the

638

:

straight man in more than one way.

639

:

And his performance, was I, I loved in

that scene too, because the way he played

640

:

that was like, he laughed and then he

realized maybe it wasn't okay to laugh.

641

:

then he checked and looked to see if they

were laughing, and then he laughed again.

642

:

Like I have felt that so many times and

I, and just in like a millisecond, all

643

:

that played out on his face that I was

like, the performances are really in this.

644

:

And Nick Frost as Don, he was so good.

645

:

So good.

646

:

When people talk about his

u like his filmography, they

647

:

never talk about kinky boots.

648

:

I think it's some of his best work.

649

:

Like he's hilarious.

650

:

Yeah.

651

:

He's predominantly a comedian guy, but

he's done a couple of dramatic things.

652

:

And this is, this was not an

easy gig to play the character

653

:

that experiences the most

654

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right.

655

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

And but the idea that he can't

656

:

tell that that's a drag queen.

657

:

What was that?

658

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

What is it?

659

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: The, that

when Lola first goes to the, to the

660

:

you call it, factory, to pick up

the first boots that Charlie has

661

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Ah, yeah.

662

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: And,

and Don is like flirting with

663

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Hey, baby.

664

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: yeah, uh,

665

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Oh,

666

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I was like, do

you really not know or is this Don real?

667

:

Like slowly learning?

668

:

He's a chaser,

669

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: well.

670

:

Some people don't even think

about the, the, the possibility

671

:

that queer people exist.

672

:

So, you know, even if she looks a little

Manish, which I didn't think she did, I

673

:

thought, I thought they did a great job

transforming her into a feminine version.

674

:

But yeah, the, that was great.

675

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

676

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I lived out at the end.

677

:

Um, everybody was at the bar.

678

:

Everybody was at the bar.

679

:

You know the Hulk factory shows up.

680

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: boots.

681

:

Did you notice like Mr.

682

:

Mr.

683

:

Biggie over there had the boots

684

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

No, I didn't notice that.

685

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Not

Don, but the guy sitting next

686

:

to him, the really big guy.

687

:

So it, when Lola does go to the bar to not

the bar to the factory, she, she knew that

688

:

it was be, she knew Charlie didn't want

her to, like, she clocked him immediately

689

:

when they were still in London.

690

:

She was like, yeah, this is, so there

was a scene where like, she touched

691

:

him and he flinched and she was

like, as if, don't flatter yourself.

692

:

They, they really set that stage

of sh this is her every day.

693

:

She deals with this shit every day.

694

:

It's nothing new under

the sun for her that.

695

:

You know, a, a cis straight boy is

disgusted by her existence and she puts

696

:

together that he doesn't want her to

come to the factory to pick up the boots.

697

:

'cause he's like, I'll bring, I'll

bring 'em to you, I'll bring 'em to you.

698

:

So

699

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

700

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: shows up and

she's like, don't ever try to get me

701

:

to do something 'cause I'm gonna do it.

702

:

But like, not everybody hates her on site.

703

:

Actually, most people are either neutral

or really respect her immediately.

704

:

And a lot of it, a lot of the

women who worked at the factory

705

:

are immediately drawn to her.

706

:

Like they find her funny and impressive.

707

:

They like that.

708

:

She stands up to Charlie when she

starts describing style basically.

709

:

You know, she was like, after she

says, I can't believe I inspired

710

:

something, that something burgundy.

711

:

She starts to start screaming

712

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah.

713

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

And she was like.

714

:

You're selling sex.

715

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: sex.

716

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: And

he goes, but they're comfy.

717

:

And she said, sex isn't comfy.

718

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Thank goodness.

719

:

I thought it was just

720

:

there were a few times I belly laughed.

721

:

There were some really good lines.

722

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

723

:

the, the part, so like, she, she

doesn't s want to stay though

724

:

because it's painful to her.

725

:

Like this experience that she has Don

is flirting with her and she goes down

726

:

and sits in his lap and she's like,

if you can't even get women to wear

727

:

these, how do you, how do you expect

to get a blokes like me to wear them?

728

:

Don is like.

729

:

It was, it was, even though I, I knew

it was coming, it was still upsetting

730

:

because I am, I walk around with this

fear that if people knew I was trans,

731

:

that they would be disgusted by me or

that people already are disgusted by me.

732

:

And I, I think, I don't know if

it's, I don't think that that's only

733

:

trans people that feel that way.

734

:

I think that that's kind of

a, a minoritized experience,

735

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Oh yeah, I certainly feel that way

736

:

Being a less than feminine woman.

737

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: yeah.

738

:

And so after that, when, when she's

still there, she's drawing the,

739

:

the boot Charlie, we hear Don in

the background downstairs, like

740

:

retching and screaming and, and.

741

:

Like, that's the, that's the

background of that scene of

742

:

her whole basically time there.

743

:

So she doesn't wanna stay because it

feels, it doesn't feel good to be there.

744

:

And Charlie's trying to convince her to

stay and he finally does wear her down to

745

:

stay until the, we find out that there's

like a, a fashion show for shoes in Milan.

746

:

And I don't even know

if this is a real thing.

747

:

I'm so out of the, the, the

loop on fashion stuff like

748

:

the, i is, is this real?

749

:

Hang on, let me,

750

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Sounds like a time for for

751

:

a dash to go to Google.

752

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Milan runway

shoe highlights from Milan Fashion Week.

753

:

Oh, it was just a few weeks ago.

754

:

Okay.

755

:

So yeah, it's a real thing.

756

:

But I, I don't like, do

they always go to it?

757

:

Are they, in the past have these

people been like, just marching their

758

:

brogues down the catwalk in Milan?

759

:

Like, that just sounds weird to me.

760

:

But for whatever reason, this year,

they're gonna take shoes to the

761

:

shoe show, the, the shoe carnival,

762

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

The shoe store.

763

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: and

he is like, I need your help.

764

:

I can't do this.

765

:

And he flatters her a little bit, but he's

also telling the truth about the fact.

766

:

He says, in one in the time it took

you to draw a shoe, you have, you've

767

:

impacted and said more about what this

what this means than, than I ever will.

768

:

So he makes a case that he needs her to

do this, so she decides to stay and that.

769

:

The next, she has a room with this, I

don't catch her name, this older lady

770

:

that you mentioned earlier, the first

day she goes to the factory to work.

771

:

We see her like, and we

know what she's doing.

772

:

She's looking at all of her outfits,

she's laid out all of her dresses,

773

:

and she's like, trying to decide.

774

:

And I knew instantly what she was

trying to decide, like, do I dress

775

:

as a woman or do I dress as a man?

776

:

remember every fucking Thanksgiving

having that like, conversation with

777

:

myself, like, which gender do I

present to go be around these people?

778

:

And so she shows up at the factory

wearing a really awful men's sweater.

779

:

She

780

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

The turtleneck.

781

:

Yeah.

782

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: oh, it

wasn't just 'cause Chiwetel Ejiofor

783

:

is objectively attractive, right?

784

:

He's a, he's a very pretty man,

they, it was a combination of

785

:

his performance and like just

that sweater, like he looked bad.

786

:

Simon and he did it.

787

:

did he, why did he choose men's clothes?

788

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Well, does it, does the film ever

789

:

explicitly tell us that Lola is trans?

790

:

Because they, she refers to

herself as a drag queen very often.

791

:

Right?

792

:

So

793

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

794

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: maybe

she, maybe the drag just is drag, you

795

:

know, maybe she was coming into work,

so she thought that she should dress

796

:

in a particular way that would match.

797

:

I, I don't know.

798

:

Maybe she just wanted to get real.

799

:

I don't know.

800

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I think

she wanted to put people at ease.

801

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

That could be it too.

802

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Because the performance, like the

803

:

way that he was performing this

moment was extreme discomfort.

804

:

was really uncomfortable in

that outfit or in that context.

805

:

He would've preferred to

be in a dress, I think.

806

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah

807

:

I only gather that the

character's name was Mrs.

808

:

Cobb, by the way.

809

:

I looked it up.

810

:

That because Mrs.

811

:

Cobb, that situation,

um, everything's on IMDB.

812

:

That, that scene I think was really

pivotal because it, it shows that in

813

:

his real life, when he's tucked away,

when he's not in view of anyone, in

814

:

his most quiet moment, he is a woman.

815

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

816

:

Yeah.

817

:

And.

818

:

I think that at the time we weren't

having this conversations about what

819

:

is trans versus, do you remember in Tu

Fu they actually said like, you know, a

820

:

transvestite is, is this a drag queen?

821

:

Is this a transsexual?

822

:

Is this like,

823

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

And you're a boy in a dress.

824

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

825

:

And she, like, Lola does

it a little bit too.

826

:

She's like, I'm not a transvestite

because transvestites are ugly.

827

:

Essentially I'm a drag

queen because I'm fabulous.

828

:

So I don't know.

829

:

It's, I don't think it's something that

we can really decode with how that, like

830

:

into, I don't think we can make it make

sense with how we think about identity and

831

:

gender performance and presentation now.

832

:

I just don't know that there's, there's

hope of bringing Lola into that context.

833

:

I wonder what the musical does, right?

834

:

Because they're still performing this.

835

:

Surely they would do

something to update it.

836

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

You not seen the musical?

837

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: mm-hmm.

838

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

Yeah, me neither.

839

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: But ultimately

it doesn't help if, if she did show up

840

:

dressed as a man in the hopes that Dom

and and his buddies would be nicer to her.

841

:

It does not do

842

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: No,

843

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: In a way it's

kind of worse because masculinity is

844

:

something that Don cares a lot about.

845

:

And she was, she was doing femininity

before, but now she's doing

846

:

masculinity and she's not doing

it particularly well, you know?

847

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

that's a good point.

848

:

I.

849

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Because

Don, that's all he talks a lot about.

850

:

Like, well, women love me because

of this, and the moment where

851

:

things start to change for him.

852

:

He's like doing things to bully her.

853

:

Like I couldn't actually tell what

they wrote on the sign something.

854

:

It said something about queer shoes.

855

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I don't remember.

856

:

I can see if it's on the thing though.

857

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: But that's when

Lola goes over and she's like, Hey, what

858

:

do you think would make me more of a man?

859

:

Basically, like you seem to care

a lot about me and my manness.

860

:

And she's like, I'll you

write down something that's

861

:

gonna make me more of a man.

862

:

I'll write something that down, something

that's gonna make you more of a man.

863

:

And he's like, no, because he,

I don't think he wants to enter

864

:

into, a context where she has

any say over what masculinity is.

865

:

But then the thing that changes

his mind is the girls, I love this.

866

:

I, I wrote it down.

867

:

They're like, do you, is is Don a man?

868

:

And another girl says, I don't know.

869

:

He dresses like one, which is

just like the perfect way to

870

:

describe performing a gender.

871

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I found that quote.

872

:

Let me read it to you.

873

:

Lola.

874

:

Lauren says, Lola, you're

gonna have to excuse Charlie.

875

:

We don't have many

transvestites in North Hampton.

876

:

Lola says, I'm not merely

a transvestite sweetheart.

877

:

I'm also a drag queen.

878

:

It's a simple equation.

879

:

A drag queen puts on a frock.

880

:

Looks like a Kylie, a

transvestite, puts on a frock.

881

:

Looks like Boris Yeltsin

in lipstick there.

882

:

I said it.

883

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024:

Which I, I still don't actually

884

:

would know what that means.

885

:

Oh, I think I know.

886

:

Well, I think, well, the difference,

I guess would be the, the performance

887

:

aspect, like literal performance,

like a drag queen does it for money,

888

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Do we

know anything about the actor's sexuality?

889

:

I assume him in a heteronormative

world to be a straight man,

890

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I do as well.

891

:

Let me look and see if he's got a

spouse listed on IMDB, which doesn't

892

:

tell the full story, but he doesn't.

893

:

Hmm.

894

:

Personal life, literally

nothing about dating life

895

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

so he might be where.

896

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Could be.

897

:

That's a common thread among.

898

:

People, how old is he?

899

:

Oh, he's, uh, a little bit older than you.

900

:

Yeah.

901

:

Like Hollywood men prior to, you know, gen

Z or, uh, millennial and stuff like that.

902

:

Like it's, a lot of them were just b

bachelors, although some people just

903

:

don't want their personal life out

904

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Right,

905

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: But

the thing that Dom writes down,

906

:

for Lola to prove her masculinity,

out to be arm wrestling, which is,

907

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: right.

908

:

I liked his winning

streak from:

909

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: this

was a moment where I started to,

910

:

there's a, a theorist that I like.

911

:

Uh, called, uh, Mikhail Bakhtin, who

has this concept of the carnival esque

912

:

and a kind of parody he calls travesty.

913

:

And I started to get some of that at,

uh, from this movie, this watch, like,

914

:

okay, what, what is a masculinity contest?

915

:

Like, there's nothing more

on the nose, but also kind

916

:

of stupid than arm wrestling.

917

:

So the, the pivotal moment for Don,

and I think one for Lola happens here

918

:

because up until this point, Lola, we

haven't really seen her display any

919

:

compassion or empathy for any of these.

920

:

Northerners, right.

921

:

That she, I wouldn't say that she like,

goes out of her way to look down on

922

:

them, but she's certainly not treating

them as as sophisticated as her when

923

:

it comes to something like style.

924

:

Right.

925

:

She's got a lot of, disdain

926

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

not classism.

927

:

It's what is gay sex like,

928

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: tower.

929

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

but with gay, a gay twist, gay

930

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Like

931

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

presumptuous,

932

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: I don't,

ivory tower is more like, uh,

933

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

academic

934

:

rainbow tower.

935

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

936

:

But well in, well, and what we're trying

to, to get at here is, uh, a kind of.

937

:

of people who think that their sense

of taste and style is the best, right?

938

:

They're obviously elite in that way.

939

:

Elitism maybe.

940

:

Think like Miranda Priestly

and Devil Wears Prada.

941

:

She is, she is a taste maker, so

she's elitist about her own views and

942

:

automatically assumes them to be correct

and superior to anybody else's views.

943

:

And so like, there's a little bit

of that with Lola, even though these

944

:

people are literally craftsmen, right?

945

:

Like they make shoot, they do something

that hardly anybody else would be

946

:

able to do, but they're not stylists.

947

:

So, so this moment though is so tense.

948

:

Did you know how it was gonna go

949

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: No

950

:

um,

951

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: wrestle?

952

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I thought, you know, I thought

953

:

that he would beat her, right?

954

:

But I didn't think she would let him win.

955

:

So

956

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Yeah.

957

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I thought just because he was such a

958

:

good arm wrestler, I didn't think that,

you know, he was the champion for five

959

:

years running, but she whoops him.

960

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: Well, we know

something about Lola that he doesn't know,

961

:

which is that she's incredibly strong

because her father made her a boxer.

962

:

was a, like a, in a, in a hyper

masculine kind of context, which

963

:

is common for gender traders.

964

:

I guess we could just say like anybody

who, who later becomes uh, trans or

965

:

something like that, it's actually common

for them to be hyper performing whatever

966

:

gender they were assigned at birth.

967

:

I've heard a lot of trans women in

particular say like, they were trying to

968

:

convince themselves, like they're trying

to like, get rid of all femininity.

969

:

But yeah, she was, she was

a boxer, an amateur boxer.

970

:

So she's very strong.

971

:

during this arm wrestling

bout she starts to win, right?

972

:

She's actually really close to

taking him all the way down.

973

:

This is another place where there's not

a lot of moments in this movie where

974

:

cinema, like, where cinematography and,

and technical details are that relevant.

975

:

But this is one of them because the

performances of the two of them during

976

:

this contest, the way the camera is

framing each of their faces and cutting

977

:

between them, see these, these two

character arcs play out one where

978

:

Lola is realizing that she can beat

him, that she's stronger than him, and

979

:

then he's realizing the same thing.

980

:

And the way sort of begins to

realize that it's worth more to her.

981

:

To let him save face and win the

service of getting, getting closer

982

:

to him, like maybe breaking him down

and getting somewhere where she can

983

:

actually, like, I don't know, gain

some ground with him and then him like

984

:

realizing like, she's gonna beat me.

985

:

She's stronger than me.

986

:

What does this mean about me?

987

:

Like, he has this whole crisis

of masculinity and his role, his

988

:

image, like, and the way his face

like shows us that and then all

989

:

of a sudden she just lets him win.

990

:

I was impressed that he came

over and talked to her afterwards

991

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Yeah,

992

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: and because

he specifically asked her why she did it.

993

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024:

I don't remember what she said.

994

:

dash_36_04-18-2026_124024: She said,

I don't remember exactly, but she said

995

:

like, I wouldn't want you to have to

walk into uh, factory and not, not

996

:

be respected or something like that.

997

:

And because she said, and then she said,

uh, I don't, I wouldn't want anybody

998

:

else to know what that feels like.

999

:

beck-guest39_37_04-18-2026_134024: Gotcha.

:

00:45:57,568 --> 00:45:59,758

-:

she understood and what she was

:

00:45:59,758 --> 00:46:04,838

talking about was like fitting into a

context and being, being somebody who

:

00:46:04,838 --> 00:46:06,218

doesn't have the benefit of the doubt.

:

00:46:06,218 --> 00:46:10,568

Like she, in that one little

interaction, she made him understand.

:

00:46:11,018 --> 00:46:12,488

What it's like to be an outsider.

:

00:46:12,968 --> 00:46:16,818

What's at risk for people who don't

have the benefit of the doubt, who

:

00:46:16,818 --> 00:46:18,618

don't have certain social privileges.

:

00:46:19,018 --> 00:46:25,208

He was forced to imagine what it would be

like to lose cultural collateral was all

:

00:46:25,268 --> 00:46:30,708

to do with his job as a cobbler in this

factory and as an arm wrestling champion.

:

00:46:31,108 --> 00:46:34,658

That's not a lot of stuff

losing one of those things.

:

00:46:35,058 --> 00:46:37,768

I mean, that would be

probably huge for him.

:

00:46:38,168 --> 00:46:41,768

So she decided not to take it away

because she understands what that's like.

:

00:46:42,168 --> 00:46:43,248

-:

Have I ever told you my arm

:

00:46:43,248 --> 00:46:44,568

wrestling teaching story?

:

00:46:44,968 --> 00:46:47,368

-:

I think you somebody, yeah, it

:

00:46:47,368 --> 00:46:48,478

was like a scavenger hunt or

:

00:46:48,568 --> 00:46:48,928

-:

:

00:46:48,928 --> 00:46:50,008

And somebody ran in.

:

00:46:50,008 --> 00:46:50,578

-:

and they needed to.

:

00:46:50,998 --> 00:46:51,148

-:

:

00:46:51,148 --> 00:46:53,818

And they wanted to arm wrestle, so I arm

wrestled him, but she thought, I think

:

00:46:53,818 --> 00:46:55,048

she thought I was gonna let her win.

:

00:46:55,348 --> 00:46:56,248

Hell no.

:

00:46:57,857 --> 00:46:59,627

I brought honor to my classroom that day.

:

00:47:00,187 --> 00:47:02,647

-:

I would be very good at arm wrestling.

:

00:47:02,647 --> 00:47:03,727

It's been a long time since I've done it

:

00:47:03,937 --> 00:47:04,327

-:

:

00:47:04,727 --> 00:47:05,807

No, I'm weak as everything.

:

00:47:05,807 --> 00:47:07,317

I'm a, I'm a baby.

:

00:47:07,737 --> 00:47:08,877

I have an infant strength.

:

00:47:09,277 --> 00:47:12,247

Yeah, but walking, we're gonna start

walking this summer, so that's very good.

:

00:47:12,647 --> 00:47:13,187

-:

:

00:47:13,587 --> 00:47:14,607

-:

Maybe I'll be stronger.

:

00:47:15,007 --> 00:47:16,062

-:

you start lifting weights.

:

00:47:16,462 --> 00:47:17,877

-:

You know, I did that when I was

:

00:47:17,877 --> 00:47:19,197

working out with our friend Clha.

:

00:47:19,257 --> 00:47:22,587

She and I worked out, uh, quite a bit

for a couple of years and she had me

:

00:47:22,587 --> 00:47:24,267

weight lifting and I really enjoyed it.

:

00:47:24,467 --> 00:47:25,847

It's just picking up heavy shit, but.

:

00:47:26,162 --> 00:47:26,312

-:

:

00:47:26,712 --> 00:47:30,902

I almost splurged on a set of weights, but

I was just like, that's too much money.

:

00:47:31,302 --> 00:47:34,322

But, you know, I can't

do pushups right now.

:

00:47:34,722 --> 00:47:37,332

Maybe let's take a break to hear

from this week's sponsor before we

:

00:47:37,332 --> 00:47:40,872

finish the story, because it's about

to change and get very dramatic.

:

00:47:41,272 --> 00:47:42,902

So, oh shit.

:

00:47:42,902 --> 00:47:44,552

I was gonna do a bit

and I forgot about it.

:

00:47:44,952 --> 00:47:49,102

I was gonna pretend that the person

that Don's character was based

:

00:47:49,102 --> 00:47:53,752

on started a consulting firm for,

workplace sensitivity trainings.

:

00:47:55,114 --> 00:47:59,444

But I also knew that you wouldn't believe

me, so, This week's episode of Queer

:

00:47:59,444 --> 00:48:03,884

Next is sponsored by Load Bearing Group's

new industrial sensitivity training.

:

00:48:04,284 --> 00:48:08,214

Professional job site runs on standard

measurements and predictable materials.

:

00:48:08,274 --> 00:48:11,004

It's about knowing how much

torque a bolt can handle and

:

00:48:11,004 --> 00:48:12,624

whether the steel is to spec.

:

00:48:12,984 --> 00:48:15,774

Lately though, a lot of crews

are introducing some substandard

:

00:48:15,774 --> 00:48:17,034

materials into the workforce.

:

00:48:17,324 --> 00:48:21,884

Specifically a set of social habits

they inherited from a grandfather who

:

00:48:21,884 --> 00:48:23,684

was convinced electricity was a fad.

:

00:48:24,084 --> 00:48:27,204

These old school assumptions are

a structural defect of the team.

:

00:48:27,234 --> 00:48:30,984

They create friction that slows down

production and makes the shift feel

:

00:48:30,984 --> 00:48:32,604

twice as long as it needs to be.

:

00:48:33,054 --> 00:48:36,504

When a senior foreman starts acting like

a panicked mule, just because the new

:

00:48:36,504 --> 00:48:41,334

hire has quote city hair unquote, or

a different way of existing, they have

:

00:48:41,334 --> 00:48:43,434

officially become a maintenance liability.

:

00:48:43,834 --> 00:48:47,104

Load-bearing group is a specialized firm

that speaks the language of the floor.

:

00:48:47,134 --> 00:48:49,654

We facilitate a workshop

called the Tolerance Check.

:

00:48:49,894 --> 00:48:53,764

This is a straightforward retooling for

crews with more work to do than time to

:

00:48:53,764 --> 00:48:58,144

argue about who gets to lock themselves in

which bathroom for their lunch break cry.

:

00:48:58,544 --> 00:49:00,404

start with a component inspection.

:

00:49:00,734 --> 00:49:04,574

You take those first impressions, the

ones making you act like a territorial

:

00:49:04,574 --> 00:49:07,484

dog in the bed of a pickup, and you

put them in the diagnostic rack.

:

00:49:07,884 --> 00:49:12,744

Judging a coworker based on a:

spec sheet identifies a legacy

:

00:49:12,744 --> 00:49:14,484

part causing a system error.

:

00:49:14,784 --> 00:49:17,094

We show you how to pull that

bias out, toss it in the

:

00:49:17,094 --> 00:49:18,504

scrap heap where it belongs.

:

00:49:18,714 --> 00:49:20,304

Our iron rule is simple.

:

00:49:20,304 --> 00:49:24,414

A person's worth is measured in torque,

reliability, and their ability to hold

:

00:49:24,414 --> 00:49:26,064

the other end of the heavy lifting.

:

00:49:26,484 --> 00:49:29,274

If they hit the specs, they have

earned their spot in the bay.

:

00:49:29,334 --> 00:49:29,814

Period.

:

00:49:30,214 --> 00:49:32,794

you're wrong about a coworker

is an elite maneuver.

:

00:49:33,094 --> 00:49:36,394

Sure it takes some muscle to hold

a grudge or bias, but it takes real

:

00:49:36,394 --> 00:49:38,434

strength to recalibrate your perspective.

:

00:49:38,794 --> 00:49:41,464

Solidarity is a personal

and professional survival

:

00:49:41,464 --> 00:49:43,774

requirement, not an HR suggestion.

:

00:49:44,174 --> 00:49:47,264

So check out the tolerance, check

from the load-bearing group.

:

00:49:47,654 --> 00:49:48,974

Change your mind about someone.

:

00:49:49,004 --> 00:49:51,224

It's the most productive thing

you can do with boots on.

:

00:49:51,841 --> 00:49:52,891

Have you done any of those?

:

00:49:52,891 --> 00:49:57,311

The workplace, like in a group,

not the, you know, the ones that at

:

00:49:57,311 --> 00:49:58,721

universities, they make us just like watch

:

00:49:59,081 --> 00:50:00,291

-:

Oh yeah, yeah.

:

00:50:00,291 --> 00:50:01,281

I've done plenty of those.

:

00:50:01,681 --> 00:50:03,871

-:

another version where like a consulting

:

00:50:03,871 --> 00:50:09,753

firm comes in and you do like uh, a

day or meet a week or, or more of like

:

00:50:10,153 --> 00:50:12,493

intensive learning training things.

:

00:50:12,893 --> 00:50:13,853

-:

No, I haven't.

:

00:50:14,253 --> 00:50:14,838

I haven't done that.

:

00:50:15,238 --> 00:50:17,008

-:

I mean, they're kind of neat, but

:

00:50:17,188 --> 00:50:18,838

I've facilitated a few of them.

:

00:50:19,238 --> 00:50:22,598

It's also like you are stuck with some

of the worst people you will ever know.

:

00:50:22,598 --> 00:50:25,418

There's always at least one

person that you'll never forget

:

00:50:25,448 --> 00:50:26,108

-:

Oh, you're talking about

:

00:50:26,108 --> 00:50:27,308

speaking women's studies, huh?

:

00:50:27,708 --> 00:50:28,758

-:

:

00:50:34,492 --> 00:50:38,602

Well, after Don makes his, he

starts to turn a new leaf, right?

:

00:50:38,602 --> 00:50:40,942

He's no longer disgusted by Lola.

:

00:50:40,972 --> 00:50:43,642

He sort of respects her values.

:

00:50:44,042 --> 00:50:47,732

Begins to value like her

as a thought leader in this

:

00:50:47,762 --> 00:50:49,932

company designing the shoes.

:

00:50:50,197 --> 00:50:52,297

it's coming up on time

for the Milan thing.

:

00:50:52,297 --> 00:50:53,407

It's getting close.

:

00:50:53,807 --> 00:50:54,437

I forget.

:

00:50:54,437 --> 00:50:57,777

There's this scene where he and

Lauren are on the phone and they're

:

00:50:57,777 --> 00:51:01,987

trying to do something that costs

money and they need like $20,000.

:

00:51:01,987 --> 00:51:02,827

What was it for?

:

00:51:02,827 --> 00:51:03,637

Do you remember?

:

00:51:04,053 --> 00:51:07,503

like she's on the phone with somebody

and they're trying to rent something

:

00:51:07,903 --> 00:51:08,863

and it costs a bunch of money.

:

00:51:08,863 --> 00:51:10,453

It's something to do with Milan.

:

00:51:10,853 --> 00:51:12,773

no way, there's not a

Google search for this.

:

00:51:12,973 --> 00:51:14,623

Either way they need something.

:

00:51:15,023 --> 00:51:16,283

Maybe it was the performers

:

00:51:16,683 --> 00:51:18,058

-:

they, they said the travel

:

00:51:18,058 --> 00:51:19,558

and the, and the, all of that.

:

00:51:19,558 --> 00:51:19,888

Yeah.

:

00:51:20,038 --> 00:51:20,533

Yeah, you're right.

:

00:51:20,933 --> 00:51:21,353

-:

:

00:51:21,603 --> 00:51:26,583

And he decides to like take out another

mortgage on his house to pay for this.

:

00:51:26,973 --> 00:51:31,053

And he did not run it right by his

fiance, which I was actually like,

:

00:51:31,053 --> 00:51:32,913

that's a valid crash out on her part.

:

00:51:32,913 --> 00:51:37,693

Like he made a pretty significant

financial decision without consulting her,

:

00:51:37,938 --> 00:51:38,288

-:

:

00:51:38,688 --> 00:51:39,588

-:

like their relationship.

:

00:51:39,588 --> 00:51:41,538

This is one of the reasons

why could've, we could've just

:

00:51:41,538 --> 00:51:42,918

done without it, you know?

:

00:51:43,318 --> 00:51:46,268

don't know what that was for, his

first relationship 'cause it was

:

00:51:46,268 --> 00:51:50,108

just them falling, realizing they

didn't want to be married basically.

:

00:51:50,108 --> 00:51:51,878

That was her entire role in this movie.

:

00:51:52,278 --> 00:51:57,718

That and being the thing that caused him

to feel like he should be mean to Lola.

:

00:51:58,118 --> 00:52:00,288

But anyway, they have a fight.

:

00:52:00,498 --> 00:52:01,578

Lola's there.

:

00:52:01,978 --> 00:52:06,288

does this thing where she like tar

turns the microphone on so that

:

00:52:06,288 --> 00:52:10,348

Don can hear Charlie talk about

how much the factory means to him,

:

00:52:10,748 --> 00:52:12,038

-:

Do you think she did that on purpose?

:

00:52:12,319 --> 00:52:12,739

-:

:

00:52:12,769 --> 00:52:13,219

Yeah.

:

00:52:13,619 --> 00:52:14,159

Yeah.

:

00:52:14,439 --> 00:52:17,989

I don't think it she did the first

time, but I think because it happened

:

00:52:17,989 --> 00:52:19,789

once before and it was just kind of a,

:

00:52:20,189 --> 00:52:20,479

-:

:

00:52:20,664 --> 00:52:23,904

-:

the rest of them got introduced to her.

:

00:52:23,904 --> 00:52:26,754

The, like the people who worked at

the factory, but she looked at it

:

00:52:26,754 --> 00:52:30,174

before she did it and she saw, she

knew Don was down there, so Yeah.

:

00:52:30,574 --> 00:52:35,784

But then after I, you know, he

Charlie and I forget his fiance's

:

00:52:36,129 --> 00:52:36,549

-:

:

00:52:36,949 --> 00:52:39,049

-:

No, Lauren is the assistant.

:

00:52:39,449 --> 00:52:39,669

-:

:

00:52:40,069 --> 00:52:42,174

-:

She is played by Jamima Ruper.

:

00:52:42,574 --> 00:52:45,034

It's funny, I know the actress's

name, but not the character.

:

00:52:45,434 --> 00:52:46,394

-:

looking here.

:

00:52:46,794 --> 00:52:47,514

Nicola.

:

00:52:47,914 --> 00:52:48,454

Nicola.

:

00:52:48,854 --> 00:52:49,064

-:

:

00:52:49,064 --> 00:52:49,814

Nicola?

:

00:52:50,239 --> 00:52:50,359

-:

:

00:52:50,759 --> 00:52:54,194

-:

of break up and Charlie is like really

:

00:52:54,524 --> 00:53:00,474

sad and upset or whatever, but also, I

don't think he was that shocked, but he

:

00:53:00,874 --> 00:53:05,764

Lola are like gonna go to a restaurant

or something to talk about the.

:

00:53:06,164 --> 00:53:10,054

At the fashion show, and she happens

to be there with a guy that I think

:

00:53:10,054 --> 00:53:11,764

she was cheating on him all along.

:

00:53:12,554 --> 00:53:16,574

This was, this was the real estate

developer and it, but I think that

:

00:53:16,574 --> 00:53:19,644

they were also, either that or

they spent enough time together

:

00:53:19,644 --> 00:53:21,114

to become attracted to each other.

:

00:53:21,364 --> 00:53:24,994

And we identify her through the

shoes that she wanted earlier.

:

00:53:24,994 --> 00:53:29,894

There's a, it was a pair of red Jimmy

Chus that she bought, and we see them

:

00:53:30,314 --> 00:53:36,244

flirting with a man's shoes under the

table same restaurant that Joel or, uh,

:

00:53:36,244 --> 00:53:38,314

that Charlie has gone to, to meet Lola.

:

00:53:38,714 --> 00:53:41,564

And he runs into this guy in the bathroom.

:

00:53:41,564 --> 00:53:46,764

And so he realizes she's there and they've

run away before he comes out, but he

:

00:53:46,764 --> 00:53:49,714

sees her shoes stuck in the cobblestone.

:

00:53:50,114 --> 00:53:54,324

So he knew they were there and

he was really booty and mad.

:

00:53:54,324 --> 00:53:55,944

And when Lola gets there.

:

00:53:56,344 --> 00:53:58,444

That's when he decides to lash out at her.

:

00:53:58,844 --> 00:54:02,209

I, I wonder if he believed some of

the things he was said to her, or

:

00:54:02,209 --> 00:54:07,159

was he just like repeating the biases

that we all have, you know, because

:

00:54:07,399 --> 00:54:09,259

we all have access to those things.

:

00:54:09,659 --> 00:54:10,229

-:

What do you mean?

:

00:54:10,534 --> 00:54:13,214

-:

like, if you say you get in a fight

:

00:54:13,214 --> 00:54:17,084

with a, a sibling or a romantic partner

or something like that, and you say

:

00:54:17,084 --> 00:54:21,384

something you didn't mean because,

just because you wanted to hurt them.

:

00:54:21,784 --> 00:54:22,074

-:

:

00:54:22,474 --> 00:54:23,794

-:

Was he doing that?

:

00:54:24,184 --> 00:54:26,584

Was he just doing, trying

to hurt her or was he saying

:

00:54:26,584 --> 00:54:27,844

things that he secretly thought?

:

00:54:28,244 --> 00:54:29,144

-:

That's a good question.

:

00:54:29,544 --> 00:54:31,884

-:

know if I really know the answer.

:

00:54:31,884 --> 00:54:34,519

Like I feel like it could be either or.

:

00:54:34,919 --> 00:54:37,739

That's kind of what's awful

for Lola, is that she'll never

:

00:54:38,024 --> 00:54:38,444

-:

:

00:54:38,844 --> 00:54:40,764

-:

she could ask herself that question

:

00:54:40,764 --> 00:54:46,134

and she'll, she, she'll never know

whether he was just being hurtful or

:

00:54:46,134 --> 00:54:47,784

if he actually thinks those things.

:

00:54:48,184 --> 00:54:49,744

-:

But in the end, in the end,

:

00:54:49,744 --> 00:54:50,624

it didn't seem to matter.

:

00:54:50,764 --> 00:54:52,464

She showed up for him

when he needed it anyway.

:

00:54:52,864 --> 00:54:53,314

-:

:

00:54:53,714 --> 00:54:57,734

You know, let's talk about this

like fashion week thing, because

:

00:54:58,134 --> 00:54:58,644

-:

:

00:54:58,644 --> 00:55:00,159

-:

gonna, she's gonna hang him out to dry.

:

00:55:00,319 --> 00:55:00,399

Hmm.

:

00:55:00,744 --> 00:55:01,584

-:

in the trivia.

:

00:55:01,584 --> 00:55:03,234

It actually said what it was called.

:

00:55:03,634 --> 00:55:04,744

The shoe fair depicted.

:

00:55:05,144 --> 00:55:06,704

The Schu fair depicted actually exists.

:

00:55:06,704 --> 00:55:08,984

It's called the mic, A-M-I-C-A-M.

:

00:55:09,384 --> 00:55:12,834

It is not situated in the center of Milan,

obviously, but the, in the exhibition

:

00:55:12,834 --> 00:55:14,604

complex and the outskirts of the city,

:

00:55:14,897 --> 00:55:15,647

-:

what is it again?

:

00:55:15,647 --> 00:55:15,857

My,

:

00:55:16,990 --> 00:55:18,370

-:

M-I-C-A-M.

:

00:55:18,520 --> 00:55:19,180

Mic cam.

:

00:55:19,580 --> 00:55:20,600

-:

:

00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:21,660

-:

Mic cam.

:

00:55:22,060 --> 00:55:22,690

-:

:

00:55:23,090 --> 00:55:27,080

Yeah, it's, and we see flashes of it,

like when we're there before they go

:

00:55:27,080 --> 00:55:33,130

on, and it's just, uh, people, mostly

women, like cis women in regular

:

00:55:33,130 --> 00:55:36,130

dresses and shoes walking a catwalk.

:

00:55:36,130 --> 00:55:41,037

So it looks like a regular fashion

show, but kind of like more boring, and.

:

00:55:41,437 --> 00:55:43,897

Like Charlie is hiding this.

:

00:55:44,077 --> 00:55:46,717

He's trying to hide it, which is

stupid because it's gonna come out

:

00:55:46,717 --> 00:55:48,997

eventually that he has been mean to Lola.

:

00:55:48,997 --> 00:55:50,407

So she's probably not gonna show up.

:

00:55:50,807 --> 00:55:56,620

And Lauren is so mad at him she again,

like, says to him like, she kind of

:

00:55:56,620 --> 00:56:00,370

implies that he is not trying very hard,

he's not trying everything he can think

:

00:56:00,370 --> 00:56:02,750

of, which has been that that's true.

:

00:56:02,785 --> 00:56:04,280

That that was kind of like his thing.

:

00:56:04,810 --> 00:56:09,530

he's, he's a very mediocre person,

Charlie, you know, and all of

:

00:56:09,530 --> 00:56:13,730

these other people keep showing up

to help him and to bail him out.

:

00:56:14,130 --> 00:56:17,520

He does have to do the occasional

uncomfortable thing, though.

:

00:56:17,910 --> 00:56:22,590

He does rise to the occasion, which I, it

is kind of interesting that he did this

:

00:56:22,590 --> 00:56:24,690

because like they get to the show and.

:

00:56:25,090 --> 00:56:30,410

Lola and her friends don't show up and

he decides he's gonna model the shoes.

:

00:56:30,810 --> 00:56:33,060

And this is kind of like what

they were, this is what you

:

00:56:33,060 --> 00:56:34,890

write a this script towards.

:

00:56:34,980 --> 00:56:38,970

They're like, okay, we have to get to

the walk a mile in her shoes moment.

:

00:56:39,370 --> 00:56:40,090

How do we do that?

:

00:56:40,120 --> 00:56:41,440

What's the most ridiculous way?

:

00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:44,230

Which is the only reason the Milan

fashion or shoe show thing would

:

00:56:44,230 --> 00:56:47,710

even be written into this is so that

it, because it would be a spectacle.

:

00:56:48,110 --> 00:56:51,930

He decides he's gonna model these

things in his tidy white ease.

:

00:56:52,330 --> 00:56:54,460

Why didn't he find something else to wear

:

00:56:54,610 --> 00:56:55,180

-:

:

00:56:55,487 --> 00:56:58,217

Well, what else would you wear

with those boots besides the skirt?

:

00:56:58,617 --> 00:56:59,067

-:

:

00:56:59,067 --> 00:56:59,337

Yeah.

:

00:56:59,337 --> 00:57:00,477

He didn't, he couldn't do that.

:

00:57:00,477 --> 00:57:03,127

He couldn't give up the, the rest of him.

:

00:57:03,127 --> 00:57:03,397

Right.

:

00:57:03,397 --> 00:57:07,717

He had a, a tux, or not a tux, but a

suit top and a tie and his tidy whitey

:

00:57:08,197 --> 00:57:10,727

and these thigh high snake skin.

:

00:57:10,727 --> 00:57:12,612

I think they were stiletto boots.

:

00:57:13,012 --> 00:57:13,282

It.

:

00:57:13,342 --> 00:57:16,882

I was thinking as I, as you know, I

was watching him kind of fall, uh,

:

00:57:16,912 --> 00:57:22,382

down the runway is that this is kind

of the nightmare of masculinity,

:

00:57:22,382 --> 00:57:23,972

of being humiliated in this way.

:

00:57:23,972 --> 00:57:28,282

Like when they, when they talk

about fear of being laughed at, when

:

00:57:28,282 --> 00:57:31,252

men talk about the fear of being

laughed at, it's emasculating, being

:

00:57:31,252 --> 00:57:32,632

laughed at is emasculating to them.

:

00:57:32,632 --> 00:57:33,982

It's the worst thing they can think of.

:

00:57:34,382 --> 00:57:38,972

And he like finally falls ass over

tea, kettle like cheeks up in the

:

00:57:39,262 --> 00:57:39,612

-:

:

00:57:39,842 --> 00:57:42,392

-:

is not a flattering posses position he

:

00:57:42,392 --> 00:57:44,652

falls into and people start laughing.

:

00:57:44,652 --> 00:57:45,282

He's lying there.

:

00:57:45,282 --> 00:57:47,352

And it's like, that's, that's

what they're afraid of.

:

00:57:47,752 --> 00:57:52,305

And again, Lola shows up and bails

him out with Oliver, her troop,

:

00:57:52,365 --> 00:57:52,785

-:

:

00:57:53,185 --> 00:57:55,475

-:

they modeled the rest of the shoes.

:

00:57:55,475 --> 00:57:58,235

I guess they, they must

have got ready on the way or

:

00:57:58,505 --> 00:57:58,895

-:

:

00:57:58,925 --> 00:57:59,615

-:

:

00:58:00,252 --> 00:58:00,887

-:

Movie magic.

:

00:58:01,287 --> 00:58:06,067

-:

do a, a little performance and it's,

:

00:58:06,397 --> 00:58:08,527

there's like 20, 25 of 'em up there.

:

00:58:08,557 --> 00:58:09,517

It's pretty fun.

:

00:58:09,917 --> 00:58:12,347

not like super drag like we

were talking about earlier.

:

00:58:12,347 --> 00:58:17,007

This is, there wasn't a lot of what

felt like actual drag in this movie.

:

00:58:17,337 --> 00:58:21,857

Like, there were people who were

cross-dressing but not, you know, there

:

00:58:21,857 --> 00:58:26,177

wasn't any like death drops and, and

again, this is, maybe it's, that's

:

00:58:26,177 --> 00:58:27,767

an American type of, well, it is.

:

00:58:27,767 --> 00:58:28,577

That's American.

:

00:58:28,577 --> 00:58:31,277

So I don't know what British

drag is even like, really, I,

:

00:58:31,677 --> 00:58:33,267

I think it is more humor based.

:

00:58:33,667 --> 00:58:34,237

-:

I don't know.

:

00:58:34,637 --> 00:58:37,487

Every drag queen I've ever

seen has been a comedy show, so

:

00:58:37,887 --> 00:58:38,877

at least in between.

:

00:58:39,087 --> 00:58:41,737

-:

to go, I used to go to drag shows.

:

00:58:42,127 --> 00:58:46,987

That were just bucket boots,

like lip syncing, dancing to,

:

00:58:47,407 --> 00:58:48,637

to dance tracks and stuff.

:

00:58:48,637 --> 00:58:50,617

So that's mostly what I've seen.

:

00:58:51,017 --> 00:58:51,437

-:

:

00:58:51,664 --> 00:58:52,979

I haven't seen a drag show.

:

00:58:53,009 --> 00:58:56,159

Like the last drag show I

saw was on bgs U'S campus.

:

00:58:56,672 --> 00:58:56,962

-:

:

00:58:57,362 --> 00:58:58,022

-:

Yeah, that's a,

:

00:58:58,037 --> 00:58:59,897

-:

most, mostly I've seen student drag

:

00:58:59,897 --> 00:59:01,177

shows in the past, like 10 years.

:

00:59:01,592 --> 00:59:02,132

-:

:

00:59:02,532 --> 00:59:06,402

I have realized that I haven't been,

when, when we left Huntington, Shanna

:

00:59:06,402 --> 00:59:09,552

and I and my best friend went to

the bar as a goodbye tour, right?

:

00:59:09,552 --> 00:59:13,452

We went to the Stonewall and

uh, I realized that has been 18

:

00:59:13,452 --> 00:59:16,757

years ago, so I have not stepped

foot in a gay bar in 18 years.

:

00:59:17,577 --> 00:59:19,137

That's wild to me.

:

00:59:19,537 --> 00:59:20,297

-:

I can't remember.

:

00:59:21,014 --> 00:59:23,084

probably been around that for me.

:

00:59:28,486 --> 00:59:29,711

-:

Would you like to hear this week's

:

00:59:29,711 --> 00:59:31,181

now of Appalachian interest?

:

00:59:31,581 --> 00:59:33,201

-:

just gonna ask if you brought us

:

00:59:33,426 --> 00:59:34,356

-:

I sure did.

:

00:59:34,697 --> 00:59:35,027

Okay.

:

00:59:35,027 --> 00:59:38,297

So when I say clogs, I don't mean

the chunky shoes that you wore

:

00:59:38,297 --> 00:59:39,947

to the grocery store in:

:

00:59:40,307 --> 00:59:43,187

I mean, the kind that make noise on

purpose, the kind that you wear when

:

00:59:43,187 --> 00:59:44,417

your feet are part of the music.

:

00:59:44,777 --> 00:59:47,687

This week's noun of Appalachian

interest is the humble clog

:

00:59:48,077 --> 00:59:49,487

made from sturdy hardwear.

:

00:59:49,487 --> 00:59:53,087

Wood clogs have been worn in many

cultures for hundreds of years due

:

00:59:53,087 --> 00:59:56,987

to their ability to retain warmth and

protect the foot from sharp objects.

:

00:59:57,407 --> 01:00:00,557

Although initially worn by workers for

their functional nature, they began to

:

01:00:00,557 --> 01:00:04,217

be associated with dance and performance

around the world as those wearing them

:

01:00:04,217 --> 01:00:07,367

use the soles to create rhythmic sounds

when their feet struck the ground.

:

01:00:07,767 --> 01:00:11,847

As the Appalachian region was settled in

the mid 17 hundreds by Irish, Scottish,

:

01:00:11,847 --> 01:00:15,867

English, and Dutch German groups, their

folk dances began to mix together.

:

01:00:16,167 --> 01:00:19,887

Over time, this blend turned into

a loose foot tapping style that

:

01:00:19,887 --> 01:00:22,047

became clogging as we know it today.

:

01:00:22,317 --> 01:00:24,147

Often also called flat footing.

:

01:00:24,147 --> 01:00:27,731

it's usually set to lively fiddle

and bluegrass music, and remains a

:

01:00:27,731 --> 01:00:31,481

form of personal expression in, in

a place shaped by personal freedoms.

:

01:00:31,961 --> 01:00:34,691

There's something about clogging that

feels passed down more than taught,

:

01:00:34,691 --> 01:00:37,931

though there are still clogging schools

and classes around Appalachian today.

:

01:00:38,381 --> 01:00:42,041

It's like you learned it by being around

it long enough, not by signing up for

:

01:00:42,041 --> 01:00:45,431

a class, and there's always that one

person, usually older who makes it

:

01:00:45,431 --> 01:00:48,581

look way too easy, like they've been

doing it forever and forgot that it's

:

01:00:48,581 --> 01:00:52,221

supposed to be hard and the shoes,

well, that's why we're all here today.

:

01:00:52,221 --> 01:00:53,151

The quality matters.

:

01:00:53,151 --> 01:00:54,861

The look matters and the sound matters.

:

01:00:54,861 --> 01:00:55,881

They're built to be heard.

:

01:00:56,151 --> 01:00:57,171

That's the whole point.

:

01:00:57,501 --> 01:00:58,821

You're not trying to be quiet.

:

01:00:58,821 --> 01:01:02,287

You're trying to take up space with

sound, Which all makes this a weirdly

:

01:01:02,287 --> 01:01:03,967

perfect tie in to Kinky Boots.

:

01:01:04,237 --> 01:01:04,507

Sure.

:

01:01:04,507 --> 01:01:06,277

It's a different look, but the same idea.

:

01:01:06,277 --> 01:01:08,947

Shoes aren't just about walking

from one place to another.

:

01:01:09,277 --> 01:01:11,797

They're about being seen, being

heard, and doing it in a way

:

01:01:11,797 --> 01:01:13,237

that feels authentically you.

:

01:01:13,687 --> 01:01:16,927

What makes it connect even more is

that both are really about function.

:

01:01:16,927 --> 01:01:20,617

Meeting identity clogs were built for

work and movement, but over time they

:

01:01:20,617 --> 01:01:24,577

became tied to performance and culture

in the same way the boots in the film

:

01:01:24,577 --> 01:01:29,287

start as a practical product for a range

of men, um, but shift into something that

:

01:01:29,287 --> 01:01:31,567

represents visibility and self-expression.

:

01:01:31,927 --> 01:01:35,017

In both cases, the shoe ends

up carrying more meaning that

:

01:01:35,017 --> 01:01:36,367

it was originally designed for.

:

01:01:36,847 --> 01:01:39,397

Also, I'm just saying I would

absolutely watch someone try to

:

01:01:39,397 --> 01:01:40,777

clog in the pair of those boots.

:

01:01:40,987 --> 01:01:43,417

I don't think it would go well,

but I would absolutely watch it

:

01:01:43,747 --> 01:01:45,277

and that's this week's down clogs.

:

01:01:45,277 --> 01:01:48,067

If you hear a banjo weeping softly

in a floor, getting beat up in

:

01:01:48,067 --> 01:01:51,067

the distance, just know that

somebody's having a good time.

:

01:01:51,467 --> 01:01:53,537

-:

at the beginning, that kid, little

:

01:01:53,777 --> 01:01:58,582

baby Simon was dancing in those

those heels, I mean, kind of.

:

01:01:58,912 --> 01:02:00,352

-:

you think that was a metaphor for the

:

01:02:00,352 --> 01:02:05,242

way that he was made to feel by the,

the people of the, of the shoe company.

:

01:02:05,242 --> 01:02:05,542

Right.

:

01:02:05,542 --> 01:02:07,882

He was dancing on those heels

and somebody said, stop it.

:

01:02:08,252 --> 01:02:10,652

And that's kind of what happened

to him, you know, later in life.

:

01:02:10,652 --> 01:02:14,552

I think maybe that was a, a metaphor for

the, for the wider message of the film.

:

01:02:14,952 --> 01:02:15,422

-:

:

01:02:15,822 --> 01:02:19,362

Yeah, there's a lot about like just

trusting people to find their own

:

01:02:19,362 --> 01:02:23,832

joy or to know what brings them joy

and just the weight of expectations

:

01:02:24,232 --> 01:02:26,692

well, can you think of anything

else to say about Kinky Boots?

:

01:02:26,972 --> 01:02:28,922

-:

All of my notes have been exhausted.

:

01:02:29,322 --> 01:02:29,952

Um,

:

01:02:30,352 --> 01:02:33,352

again, I like that it ends with

the whole factory at the bar.

:

01:02:33,382 --> 01:02:36,862

You know, that kinda shows the

evolution of everyone, even Don.

:

01:02:36,862 --> 01:02:38,872

I think that was, I think that was cool

:

01:02:39,272 --> 01:02:39,562

-:

:

01:02:40,369 --> 01:02:41,509

-:

because it became more,

:

01:02:41,569 --> 01:02:42,859

more than just the business.

:

01:02:42,859 --> 01:02:44,609

It became the culture.

:

01:02:45,009 --> 01:02:49,399

-:

chosen family thing is a, is a theme too.

:

01:02:49,669 --> 01:02:52,489

There are, there are a lot of things

ex there are some things explored

:

01:02:52,489 --> 01:02:57,619

here that are very pertinent to

queer culture, but it was taken

:

01:02:57,619 --> 01:03:01,339

into, uh, more like general context.

:

01:03:01,699 --> 01:03:05,059

I think they, it was kind of like

explorations of class and stuff in here

:

01:03:05,059 --> 01:03:08,189

too, like, I don't know, not as explicit.

:

01:03:08,429 --> 01:03:10,979

It is still, it just stays

very personal and stays on the

:

01:03:10,979 --> 01:03:12,569

individual, like the small scale.

:

01:03:12,569 --> 01:03:15,024

It doesn't really expand out too much.

:

01:03:15,084 --> 01:03:18,069

And that's kind of cool because

it can still signify other things.

:

01:03:18,069 --> 01:03:24,139

It can still gesture to real world things

and stay on the story of these, people.

:

01:03:24,538 --> 01:03:29,999

I think that that's like a mark of a

successful, based on a two story type of

:

01:03:30,288 --> 01:03:30,639

-:

:

01:03:30,719 --> 01:03:32,519

-:

actually stays with the people

:

01:03:32,519 --> 01:03:33,749

that the story is based on.

:

01:03:34,149 --> 01:03:37,639

Like a lot of you know, my favorite

movies, it didn't get great

:

01:03:37,639 --> 01:03:39,079

ratings when it first came out.

:

01:03:39,479 --> 01:03:40,229

I don't know why.

:

01:03:40,229 --> 01:03:43,329

I am curious if it was about, I

mean, there's a couple of like,

:

01:03:43,329 --> 01:03:46,449

questions that we've had, like,

uh, where did the choose come from?

:

01:03:46,659 --> 01:03:51,489

Or, you know, like storylines

that, not sure why they were there.

:

01:03:51,909 --> 01:03:56,049

Maybe it was that stuff, but how

much of it was to do with queerness?

:

01:03:56,513 --> 01:03:57,713

-:

think that's probably a big part of

:

01:03:57,713 --> 01:04:01,853

it because like Two Wong Food didn't

get a lot of good coverage either.

:

01:04:02,153 --> 01:04:06,503

I mean, name one good besides like

rent name one film that has gotten

:

01:04:06,503 --> 01:04:08,033

good coverage because it's queer.

:

01:04:08,433 --> 01:04:09,438

-:

Do you like rent?

:

01:04:09,838 --> 01:04:12,473

-:

I mean, I've seen it twice in person.

:

01:04:12,523 --> 01:04:15,259

So I don't really hate it, but I

wouldn't say it's among my favorites.

:

01:04:15,459 --> 01:04:16,719

I do like the Tango

:

01:04:17,174 --> 01:04:17,294

Mau.

:

01:04:18,292 --> 01:04:20,482

-:

there are things about it that I like,

:

01:04:20,482 --> 01:04:27,132

like the music is good, but like there,

the story itself, itself, I'm just

:

01:04:27,132 --> 01:04:28,932

like, oh, I hate all these people.

:

01:04:29,334 --> 01:04:31,944

I mean even, uh, I wasn't

like Brokeback Mountain.

:

01:04:32,274 --> 01:04:37,584

I think it was nominated for some awards,

like some, you know, straight World

:

01:04:37,584 --> 01:04:39,594

awards, like Oscars and stuff, I think.

:

01:04:39,994 --> 01:04:41,374

But people still,

:

01:04:41,574 --> 01:04:43,179

-:

Oh, it's still a joke to this day.

:

01:04:43,579 --> 01:04:44,538

-:

:

01:04:44,939 --> 01:04:47,139

Let me see what awards.

:

01:04:47,538 --> 01:04:49,699

So the director won an award.

:

01:04:50,099 --> 01:04:50,969

Won an academy.

:

01:04:50,969 --> 01:04:51,149

Yeah.

:

01:04:51,149 --> 01:04:55,029

It won quite a few awards and those

people, they were still just kind of

:

01:04:55,029 --> 01:04:58,439

tortured for, you know, involved with it.

:

01:04:58,679 --> 01:05:02,159

And it was the straightest of straight

people involved in this movie too.

:

01:05:02,159 --> 01:05:04,079

Like there was not a gay finger anywhere.

:

01:05:04,479 --> 01:05:08,288

and even the, the, the characters,

those were straight boys.

:

01:05:08,288 --> 01:05:10,209

I'm sorry, like that is not a gay movie.

:

01:05:10,209 --> 01:05:11,649

Brokeback Mountain is not a fucking queer

:

01:05:11,879 --> 01:05:12,229

-:

:

01:05:12,369 --> 01:05:14,799

-:

a straight movie with gay sex in it.

:

01:05:14,839 --> 01:05:15,189

-:

:

01:05:15,694 --> 01:05:16,504

-:

:

01:05:16,564 --> 01:05:18,994

I, it's, it's a really

good movie, honestly.

:

01:05:18,994 --> 01:05:22,204

Like I don't have any complaints with

the film itself, but it's like, if

:

01:05:22,504 --> 01:05:26,134

it's not, for instance, I've never

taught it in a queer cinema course.

:

01:05:26,534 --> 01:05:26,994

-:

Oh, well.

:

01:05:27,134 --> 01:05:27,554

-:

:

01:05:28,152 --> 01:05:32,242

Like it's, I would teach it in

a masculinity course for sure.

:

01:05:32,242 --> 01:05:32,252

I.

:

01:05:32,652 --> 01:05:35,982

Because it depicts a very real

thing, which is the fact that

:

01:05:35,982 --> 01:05:37,272

straight men have sex with each

:

01:05:37,322 --> 01:05:37,672

-:

:

01:05:38,072 --> 01:05:38,702

-:

:

01:05:39,062 --> 01:05:41,622

Like that's who they practice with,

:

01:05:41,802 --> 01:05:42,152

-:

:

01:05:42,221 --> 01:05:44,892

-:

if you, we got girls going to sleep

:

01:05:44,892 --> 01:05:48,252

in, what are the slumber parties

and practicing kissing each other.

:

01:05:48,462 --> 01:05:50,112

Straight men practice

fucking on each other.

:

01:05:50,512 --> 01:05:53,117

They're not gonna admit

it to you, but they do.

:

01:05:53,267 --> 01:05:54,017

And they always have.

:

01:05:54,417 --> 01:05:59,487

And sometimes they catch feelings for

one another and it's a well-known thing.

:

01:05:59,547 --> 01:05:59,937

Right?

:

01:06:00,337 --> 01:06:01,267

what that movie's about.

:

01:06:01,507 --> 01:06:06,197

So calling, even calling in a gay

movie is, is a kind of queer erasure.

:

01:06:06,197 --> 01:06:06,757

I don't know.

:

01:06:06,842 --> 01:06:10,022

You can tell I have big feelings about

it, even though it's a great movie.

:

01:06:10,142 --> 01:06:10,562

-:

:

01:06:10,962 --> 01:06:12,642

-:

it's, back to your point, I don't know.

:

01:06:12,642 --> 01:06:18,232

I mean, I don't know any, any movies that

have been what, what you would consider

:

01:06:18,232 --> 01:06:21,392

queer that have had mainstream acceptance.

:

01:06:21,792 --> 01:06:22,782

-:

because, but I'm a cheerleader.

:

01:06:22,782 --> 01:06:24,852

Might be the closest thing,

but it's not even mainstream.

:

01:06:24,852 --> 01:06:26,082

A lot of people haven't seen it.

:

01:06:26,482 --> 01:06:28,257

-:

know, that's, that's indie.

:

01:06:28,657 --> 01:06:32,927

And if you want to talk about

like, big box office releases,

:

01:06:33,327 --> 01:06:35,042

maybe people liked Carol.

:

01:06:35,599 --> 01:06:37,369

-:

bought that book, the, the Price of Salt.

:

01:06:37,429 --> 01:06:38,569

I bought that, I bought that book.

:

01:06:38,569 --> 01:06:40,369

I haven't gotten to read

it yet, maybe this summer.

:

01:06:40,620 --> 01:06:40,800

-:

:

01:06:40,800 --> 01:06:41,700

Patty Highsmith.

:

01:06:41,700 --> 01:06:41,730

I,

:

01:06:42,130 --> 01:06:42,430

-:

:

01:06:42,830 --> 01:06:44,810

-:

All right, let's Google this.

:

01:06:44,870 --> 01:06:48,390

This will be the last random thing

I Google, how do I phrase this?

:

01:06:48,790 --> 01:06:52,460

Highest grossing queer films.

:

01:06:52,908 --> 01:06:53,688

Broke Back Mountain.

:

01:06:54,088 --> 01:06:54,778

Come on.

:

01:06:55,178 --> 01:06:55,508

All right.

:

01:06:55,508 --> 01:06:55,753

What else?

:

01:06:55,753 --> 01:06:56,273

Maybe there's.

:

01:06:56,673 --> 01:06:57,603

Philadelphia.

:

01:06:57,663 --> 01:06:59,043

Okay, so

:

01:06:59,443 --> 01:07:00,588

-:

But that's, I mean, that's

:

01:07:00,588 --> 01:07:01,938

not a good representation.

:

01:07:01,938 --> 01:07:04,128

That's somebody dying of

aids, you know what I mean?

:

01:07:04,578 --> 01:07:05,628

-:

it's Right, right.

:

01:07:05,628 --> 01:07:08,008

This is, this is queer punishment.

:

01:07:08,338 --> 01:07:10,978

And it's not even like the,

the barrier gay trope, right?

:

01:07:10,978 --> 01:07:15,638

Like, first of all, a gay person

is, dies a horrible death.

:

01:07:15,638 --> 01:07:18,338

And I've only read down

to number three now.

:

01:07:18,338 --> 01:07:19,808

And that's, that's all.

:

01:07:20,048 --> 01:07:20,918

We're three for three.

:

01:07:21,318 --> 01:07:22,008

For four.

:

01:07:22,158 --> 01:07:23,298

Oh my God.

:

01:07:23,698 --> 01:07:27,848

So Brokeback Mountain,

Philadelphia Milk Boys Don't cry.

:

01:07:28,248 --> 01:07:29,088

I don't know.

:

01:07:29,238 --> 01:07:30,468

This fifth one, it's

:

01:07:30,523 --> 01:07:30,743

-:

:

01:07:32,064 --> 01:07:32,964

-:

Is this international?

:

01:07:32,964 --> 01:07:34,254

I don't know who any of these actors

:

01:07:34,509 --> 01:07:35,209

-:

what's it called?

:

01:07:35,609 --> 01:07:36,689

-:

:

01:07:37,163 --> 01:07:38,044

-:

I haven't heard of that one.

:

01:07:38,444 --> 01:07:39,163

-:

:

01:07:39,564 --> 01:07:40,734

Very random.

:

01:07:41,134 --> 01:07:44,114

Uh, after that is Priscilla

Queen of the Desert.

:

01:07:44,514 --> 01:07:45,714

Okay.

:

01:07:45,714 --> 01:07:47,514

There's another one

here that I don't know.

:

01:07:47,514 --> 01:07:48,804

Gods and Monsters

:

01:07:49,204 --> 01:07:50,329

-:

I've never heard of that one either.

:

01:07:50,729 --> 01:07:51,089

-:

:

01:07:51,489 --> 01:07:53,439

The wedding Banquet Transamerica.

:

01:07:53,439 --> 01:07:54,788

I didn't like that one.

:

01:07:55,189 --> 01:07:56,479

-:

remember seeing it in the film, in the,

:

01:07:56,584 --> 01:07:59,024

-:

Victoria, you've never seen what

:

01:07:59,129 --> 01:08:01,788

-:

the the Trans America, what's it called?

:

01:08:01,819 --> 01:08:02,809

Trans America?

:

01:08:03,061 --> 01:08:04,576

-:

Transamerica with Felicity

:

01:08:04,876 --> 01:08:05,956

-:

Yeah, I saw that in the theater.

:

01:08:05,956 --> 01:08:07,126

I remember not liking it either.

:

01:08:07,526 --> 01:08:09,066

-:

I, I didn't like it.

:

01:08:09,466 --> 01:08:10,216

Victoria Victor.

:

01:08:10,216 --> 01:08:12,286

Victoria is a very good movie.

:

01:08:12,686 --> 01:08:14,756

The hours I couldn't get through it.

:

01:08:14,816 --> 01:08:15,776

Oh, the bird cage.

:

01:08:16,176 --> 01:08:16,466

-:

:

01:08:16,640 --> 01:08:17,270

That's one

:

01:08:17,671 --> 01:08:18,631

-:

Nobody dies in that one.

:

01:08:18,720 --> 01:08:19,231

-:

:

01:08:19,631 --> 01:08:20,651

-:

:

01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:23,180

Oh, and we're back to dying, cruising.

:

01:08:23,211 --> 01:08:23,451

Okay.

:

01:08:23,451 --> 01:08:24,201

You lost me.

:

01:08:24,261 --> 01:08:25,011

You lost me.

:

01:08:25,411 --> 01:08:29,961

Clearly there is a, queer

cinema crisis in Hollywood.

:

01:08:29,991 --> 01:08:30,651

Hollywood.

:

01:08:30,651 --> 01:08:31,551

The gayest place on

:

01:08:31,746 --> 01:08:32,345

-:

:

01:08:32,746 --> 01:08:34,666

Everybody got a dream in Hollywood.

:

01:08:35,066 --> 01:08:37,706

That was the name of my car when

I was, uh, when I graduated high

:

01:08:37,706 --> 01:08:40,636

school, I had a, a bright ass purple.

:

01:08:40,636 --> 01:08:43,876

It was a, it was a deep purple, but

it was a very purple, um, Hyundai

:

01:08:43,876 --> 01:08:46,765

accent and uh, its name was Hollywood.

:

01:08:47,166 --> 01:08:48,696

Everybody got a dream in Hollywood.

:

01:08:49,095 --> 01:08:49,935

-:

Well, then the thing about

:

01:08:49,935 --> 01:08:52,845

Hollywood is that it is made by.

:

01:08:53,533 --> 01:08:59,024

Queer people and, and people of color

and non non-Americans, literally

:

01:08:59,054 --> 01:09:03,344

immigrants like that is what Hollywood

is, but it's made for white America.

:

01:09:03,743 --> 01:09:06,024

That's kind of the, the, the

whole trick of Hollywood.

:

01:09:06,424 --> 01:09:08,404

that's Kinky Boots.

:

01:09:08,804 --> 01:09:12,363

It reminded me of this other movie

that is a British movie, kind of

:

01:09:12,363 --> 01:09:17,544

similar, has similar themes of country

people, country people, and then

:

01:09:17,544 --> 01:09:21,033

like, uh, London Queers called Pride.

:

01:09:21,064 --> 01:09:28,234

And it's about union organizing in the

minors towns of like Wales, so random.

:

01:09:28,264 --> 01:09:29,554

Also based on a true story,

:

01:09:30,033 --> 01:09:30,254

-:

:

01:09:30,654 --> 01:09:31,448

very cool.

:

01:09:31,849 --> 01:09:32,209

-:

:

01:09:32,609 --> 01:09:34,573

I guess we could call this, call.

:

01:09:34,573 --> 01:09:35,294

This done.

:

01:09:35,693 --> 01:09:37,464

Thanks for hanging out with us everybody.

:

01:09:37,863 --> 01:09:41,654

I have been high on medicine,

just hoping for the best.

:

01:09:41,684 --> 01:09:43,874

I'll find out how we

did when I'm editing it.

:

01:09:44,274 --> 01:09:47,363

Uh, hopefully you've got warm

weather, weather wherever you are.

:

01:09:47,764 --> 01:09:52,004

Uh, maybe I'll get some eventually

and, you know, be good out there.

:

01:09:52,064 --> 01:09:52,844

Say hi to your mom and them.

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QUEERNECKS
Queer Appalachian Stories & Culture.
Join the lively hosts of QUEERNECKS for a unique podcast experience exploring the intersection of Appalachian culture and the LGBTQ+ experience. Dive into engaging stories, humorous anecdotes, and thoughtful discussions on everything from Appalachian traditions and local life to current events, LGBTQ+ issues, and building an inclusive community. If you're looking for a podcast that blends authentic Appalachian voices with insightful queer perspectives, offering both laughter and meaningful connection, then welcome to the QUEERNECKS family. Subscribe now and be part of our growing community!
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